• Decoy321@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    This funny meme is also a good example of survivorship bias. There are both good and shitty ACs from both eras. We’re just only comparing to the good old ACs because the shitty ones already broke.

    • DreamButt@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      While I agree with you past generations weren’t swamped with infinite selections of shitty versions of products at their fingertips. Think it feels worse now because it’s harder to find the good stuff these days

      • Altima NEO@lemmy.zip
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        1 year ago

        It’s had a lot to do with manufacturers trying to cater to a certain price point where they can maximize sales and profits, rather than simply trying to make the best product they can make. It leads to a lot of cheap garbage.

      • Decoy321@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        That’s a very valid point. Today’s ease of access to a wider variety of sources is vastly different to the pre-internet era of appliance shopping. Back then, we just went to the nearest Sears or some other appliance warehouse to try them out. They’d have just a few different models available, so those were all your options. The other method of purchase was through direct shipping catalogs, where you hoped the product you bought didn’t actually suck.

    • Draconic NEO@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      That is true, although earlier generations didn’t have access to as many different variations of a product, most of the ones available to them were the high-end versions. The trade-off is that they costed much more due to being a more premium product and being new on the market.

    • Mikekm@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Pretty sure all of my old apartments had the shitty window units, none of them ever worked.

    • beefcat@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      It’s true with most appliances.

      The problem is it is difficult to know today which appliances will still be functioning in 20 years.

  • db2@sopuli.xyz
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    1 year ago

    Air conditioner then: 2 kilowatts / ton

    Air conditioner now: 0.4 kilowatts / ton

      • Beetschnapps@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Reliability exists, just don’t buy crap. Invest and reap the efficiency. Personally, I’ve spent years with mini-splits and never had this filter problem crap, everything just works and for less than half the cost.

      • Tschuuuls@feddit.de
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        1 year ago

        You can have a super efficent one that’s reliable. Not gonna be super cheap, though. But they exist, as server rooms and critical infrastructure has to be cooled as well. Mitsubishi Heavy makes stuff like that for example.

      • toddestan@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        It’s another one of those weird non-metric units. In the world of air conditioning (or cooling in general), a “ton” is the amount of cooling you’d get from melting a ton (a short ton - that is 2000 pounds) of ice that’s already near its melting point. Air conditioners are usually rated in tons per day, with 1-5 tons about right for a typical apartment or house, depending on things like square footage and climate.

        • flucksy_bango@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          In the world of air conditioning (or cooling in general), a “ton” is the amount of cooling you’d get from melting a ton (a short ton - that is 2000 pounds) of ice that’s already near its melting point.

          I’m the kind of person to argue the merits of the imperial system, and even I think that’s bonkers.

          • LastYearsPumpkin@feddit.ch
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            1 year ago

            What do you think the metric system is based on? It’s the exact same thing.

            0c is the temperature of water freezing (at sea level, etc.etc.)

            100c is the temperature that water boils.

            1 kilocalorie is the energy needed to raise the temperature of 1kg of water one degree.

            You have to define energy in some way, and almost all of it is related to how it affects water.

            • uis@lemmy.world
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              1 year ago

              Calories are not metric. And there are even two calories. Not as bad as 10 different inches, but use Joule(metric unit, Newton*meter) instead.

        • uis@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          It’s another one of those weird non-metric units. In the world of air conditioning (or cooling in general), a “ton” is the amount of cooling you’d get from melting a ton (a short ton - that is 2000 pounds) of ice that’s already near its melting point.

          Wut? I though it was unit of power per mass of machine. Why, just why?

        • MisterFrog@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          (side note, thank you for the explanation)

          Ffs USA. YOU’RE ALREADY USING kW, JUST GO FULL METRIC ON POWER. Please I’m begging you.

          COP = heat moved / power input

          kW_out / kW_in = dimensionless value

          An air-conditioner with a COP of 2 moves 2 kW of heat for every 1 kW of electrical power you put in.

          This hurts so much to find out because the US is already using BTU/hr 🤢. What do you need yet another unit for power for?

          You’re using W, BTU/hr and ton/day?

          Like. Why are you doing this?

          😭 look what they did to my boy (units)

      • LordOfTheChia@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        In Air Conditioning a “ton” = 12000BTU of heat removal per hour.

        It originates from the amount of heat removal over a period of 24 hours needed to freeze a ton of water at 0C:

        https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ton_of_refrigeration

        A quick idea of what cooling/heating you need is your square footage (assuming 8ft ceilings) x 20.

        So 600 sq ft of area would need a 1 ton AC or 12,000BTU. Again complicated by outdoor temperature, insulation of the home, and other factors.

        Anyway, what the op was saying, for the same tonnage (cooling capacity) old ACs used a ton of electricity. Newer split units are crazy efficient.

        Like in 2000 the new requirement for a home AC was a SEER (cooling vs electric usage) of 10. The higher the rating, the less electricity used for a given cooling capacity.

        Nowadays you can get the cheaper split units which have ratings of 19-23 SEER2. So they use half or less than half the electricity for the same cooling. Also they can work as heaters in a pinch.

        Edit: Quick googling shows that ACs from the 80s could be as inefficient as 6-7 SEER. So a modern 21 SEER2 unit would use 1/3rd the electricity!

          • Dozzi92@lemmy.world
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            1 year ago

            British thermal unit. Been around for a century or more and will be around for another century after Bitcoin is gone. I say this owning Bitcoin.

            • MisterFrog@lemmy.world
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              1 year ago

              I really hope for my sanity that the US at least switches fully to kW and kWh. They’re already using it!

    • GBU_28@lemm.ee
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      1 year ago

      Drain line can clog, but as with all dad stuff, good maintenance wins the day

    • AA5B@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Even better, they now sell window units that drape over the sill on both sides for less noise, less blocking the window, no danger of falling, window closes farther

  • HamSandwichGenerator
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    1 year ago

    You forgot about the part where it is 70% asbestos and radioactive coolant. 10/10 best ACs ever.

    • NightAuthor@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      You can do a 1:1 swap of refrigerant, and if I remember correctly, the new stuff actually works better.

      • LucasWaffyWaf@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Heck, early refrigeration systems used friggen ammonia as it’s refrigerant of choice. Works good at being compressed and evaporated, shame about it being poison.

          • LucasWaffyWaf@lemmy.world
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            1 year ago

            The reason those took off so well is cause Freon, while awful for ozone, is significantly safer than the previous usage of ammonia.

            Refrigerators and air conditioners just compress a gas into a liquid, moves it through piping, and then decompresses the gas. When compressing the gas (a refrigerant), it’ll want to turn liquid, but has to burn off heaps of excess energy, done as heat energy. That’s done in the part of an AC unit that hangs outside. The liquid is then pumped to the other side of the machine, relieved of pressure, and sent through tons of piping with heat grates and fans for dissipating the cold air it generates. When evaporating from liquid to gas it needs to take in heaps of energy, so it’ll draw heat from the air, cooling it. The gas is pumped back to the compressor on the other side of the unit to repeat the process over and over. Propane is really good at being compressed like that, and it has minimal effect on global warming, so it can be used as a freon alternative. Just yanno, don’t use it in your car’s AC.

  • Montagge@kbin.social
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    1 year ago

    Weird my mini split is a workhorse. It doesn’t give two shits about dust, dirt, ice, rain, or snow. It has heated the house in single digits and cooled the house in triple digits (both F). 10/10. Best $1800 I ever spent.

      • Beetschnapps@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        I wouldn’t say nanoseconds… might be my system with multiple units,but one can take a minute to get its bearings. Once on though I really only need one unit for the whole place despite having 3.

      • Lyrl@lemm.ee
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        1 year ago

        I hoped that was a Technology Connections link, and I was not disappointed.

      • MrShankles@reddthat.com
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        1 year ago

        Thank you so much for that link! It was wildly pertinent to my life

        I just moved into a new place this weekend. It has an addition not connected to central A/C. Instead, it has a little window unit, but also a (one hose) portable unit.

        I was using the portable one, because I haven’t had time to block the hole that runs outside (especially from critters climbing through). So I hoped that the air blowing out would discourage anything from climbing in

        And now I will be taking the time to properly block the hole where the duct runs, because I immediately switched back to the window unit after watching that video

        So thank you again! It’s the first time I ever encountered a portable unit, so I knew nothing. And coincidentally, I just moved and had the option to use either the window unit or the portable

        Just ridiculously relevant to my life as of this weekend! And ya just saved me money on electricity. You’re awesome for that link my friend

    • NightAuthor@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Some significant amount of the heat that should go outside, instead gets put back into the room through the “clothes dryer vent”.

      Given the cost premium, and space used, by floor standing ACs, they’re really not worth it if you have an option.

      • shyguyblue@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        I covered mine with a mylar emergency blanket and it’s dropped the temp quite a bit. Not perfect, but it works in Texas

    • beefcat@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Every time I’ve gone to move to a new place, central air has been my top priority. I refused to consider homes that relied on window units, swamp coolers, or those floor units that are basically a scam.

      I live somewhere with cold winters and hot summers though, maybe I would feel different somewhere with more mild seasons.

  • EmoDuck@sh.itjust.works
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    1 year ago

    German here, I don’t get that joke. What the fuck’s an Air Conditioner? Some time of specail air you put in your hair after using shampoo?

    • Nico di Angelo@fed.ggtm.eu
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      1 year ago

      @EmoDuck @The_Picard_Maneuver
      Don’t many German cars have “airco”? 😅
      Anyway, in rare cases it’s to moisturize the inside air, some are able to heat, but most of them are used to cool down temperatures in a room or building (like in supermarkets in summer) and are a common thing in resident houses in the hotter parts of the world…
      I think it gets its name from being able to condition the air temperature… 😅

        • JackFrostNCola@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          To add to this, reverse cycle (aka heat pump) air conditioners will dehumidify the air during cooling operation as humidity in the air tends to condense on the (cold) indoor unit coil and leaves via the drain pipe.
          These air conditioner units usually have the modes; cool, heat, fan only & dehumidify, which is why they arent just called ‘air coolers’ or ‘heaters’.

      • averyfalken@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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        1 year ago

        So on the whole somee are able to heat thing is going to be dependent on where you live, put where I love most heatpumps (air conditioners) that are whole home units or minisplits are reversible heatpump meaning they can both heat and cool

    • Draconic NEO@lemmy.world
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      Not sure if this is the correct word for it (really bad at German) but I think the word for it is Klimaanlage.

  • Lifted_lowered@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    We need to figure out how to retrofit those old machines to be as efficient as the new ones, and be clean and pigeon free. Then we can keep them around.

    • PM_ME_FEET_PICS@sh.itjust.works
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      1 year ago

      They still make those old style ones and they are energy star certified.

      The ones that look like the new one are what’s used with heat pumps here.

      • NightAuthor@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Is there any reason a window unit couldn’t be a heat pump? My understanding is the difference is just about a single valve to reverse the direction of the coolant.

        • AA5B@lemmy.world
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          I thought it was just that it was too difficult to fit all the parts efficiently in such a small box

          When Tesla first publicized 3d printing the “octovalve” as a piece to complex to manufacture traditionally, the claim was that it made the heat pump much more compact. There was even a rumor going around that they might use it to enter the home heat pump market. Their work in making heat pumps compact enough for cars could really make a difference, however I image home stuff is much more price sensitive

        • Lyrl@lemm.ee
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          Mini-splits do exist in window-mountable form, although they haven’t really caught on (yet). Technology Connections covers alternatives like that at the end of his portable ac episode https://youtu.be/_-mBeYC2KGc

      • uis@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Uhh, old style is heat pump too. Unlesz you are referring water evaporation.

    • LordOfTheChia@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      The difficulty (just looking at the refrigerant) is the huge differences in pressure needed between refrigerants.

      Then you have to look at the compatibility of the compressor motor oils and the refrigerant.

      One example

      60 PSI to 85 PSI for R-22 and 105 PSI to 143 PSI for R-410A

      Others:

  • Destraight@lemm.ee
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    1 year ago

    Which air conditioner are you talking about specifically that shuts off when it gets dust on its filter?

    • Lyrl@lemm.ee
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      1 year ago

      It’s not that they shut off, it’s that many units are sized so questionable for the square footage they are able to cool that the filter being dusty or clean is the difference between being able to cool the room to the target temperature or not.

  • BonesOfTheMoon@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    Yes the older models are the little engine that could. (come to think of it most of you are too young to get that reference). The expensive big one threw a belt and became useless after four years.

    But I moved to a place where I’m on the shady side of the building and as a result all I need are fans.

  • whelk@lemm.ee
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    1 year ago

    I miss my old really noisy air conditioner window unit. I loved the noise from it, it drowned out other sounds and I got better sleep. My room air filters generate some decent white noise effects, but it’s just not the same.