What are the main criticisms of Linux in desktop platforms?
Many things in a FOSS ecosystem will sooner or later confront you with one hard truth:
The program you’re using was not developed for you.
It was developed because the creator saw a problem and wanted to fix it. Then they made a program to fix it and stopped refining the program the moment they were content with it. Little to no consideration for other users or mass-adoption. Which is fine, they developed it, it’s their time.
But it also means that you will frequently be confronted with things that are objectively unintuitive and unreasonable from a new user’s perspective because they make sense from a developer’s perspective. The former will always be outranked by the latter, even though there will always be more users than developers. Unfortunately that’s just how it is. There are some few exceptions, but they are just that, exceptions.Many (most?l tools I use and games I play aren’t natively compatible, and while there are sometimes free alternatives to them, they’re usually buggy, unmaintained, or lacking basic features
I’m having a hard time believing that is true of late. Unless it’s really niche?
I’ve been using it exclusively as my desktop for over 20 years. Does it have flaws and shortcomings? Sure. So have Windows and Mac. What system does not have issues?
Does it fit your use case? Who knows? Just try it and be the judge. If it doesn’t work, just keep using whatever you’re using, no harm done.
All you need is a USB stick, some curiosity and some time. It’s not like it’s a lifetime commitment or something. Unless, of course, you enjoy it… then you are doomed.
Its so much less user-hostile-by-design as well
Less user-hostile? Maybe. Hostile to the tech-illiterate? Oh, absolutely. There is no handholding. There are no guardrails. You wanna “sudo rm -fr / --no-preserve-root”? o7, gamer.
One thing that happened recently that really showcases the difference between Linux and Windows is the glibc update that broke several popular video games. These games were specifically built to run on Linux. Ironically, games built to run only on Windows could still be ran on Linux just fine. That’s because those games are run through a compatibility layer that translates the Windows instructions into their corresponding Linux instructions. The games built for Linux use Linux instructions directly, so they don’t need a compatibility layer.
The update to glibc changed how some Linux instructions worked and so any program using the old instructions needed to update to the new ones. Lots of Linux programs are actively maintained or at least open source, so making the change isn’t a big deal. Video games tend not to be open source or actively maintained after they’re released, so some of these broken games will be broken forever. When that was reported to the maintainers of glibc, they responded that they don’t care if they break unmaintained, closed source software. It is the user’s fault for choosing to use such software.
To me, that is the biggest difference between Windows and Linux. If someone creates a program for Windows, that program will likely still work 10 years from now. If someone creates a program for Linux, it could break next week, and the people who broke it won’t care. It’s a bit embarrassing that programs created for Windows work on Linux more reliably than programs created specifically for Linux.
If someone creates a program for Windows, that program will likely still work 10 years from now.
TBF, that’s not even always true, especially with a loss of 32 bit support. For example, BioShock Infinite no longer runs on newer versions of OsX
deleted by creator
It someone creates a program for Windows, that program will likely still work 10 years from now
I was with you all the way until here. This statement is absolutely laughable to anyone who has messed around with older videogames. Sometimes, if you’re lucky, running it in compatibility mode with the version of Windows the game was made for will work, but oftentimes you’re reliant on fan patches or long installation guides showing you the exact configuration of settings necessary to stop the game from constantly crashing. At that point, getting the older game to run on Windows is just as tedious as getting it to run on Linux, potentially less.
You still are getting more of a guarantee from Microsoft, because Windows versions have typically had long lifecycles and were pretty averse to risky-changes within an OS release, but even that doesn’t seem to be the case anymore with Windows 11.
The glibc incident though was self inflicted. The Devs relied on undocumented behaviour in the ABI (application binary interface) which then got fixed/changed after more than a decade by the Devs of said Library.
It was akin to relying on a videogame glitch to do something that shouldn’t have been possible and then be offended that it got patched.
If you’re considering how good software is, how it was made is irrelevant, the only thing to measure is how well it works. A criticism of Linux from a user perspective is still valid regardless of who is or isn’t to blame.
I simply wanted to add context…
Yeah, sorry, my tone was too harsh there, it’s definitely relevant context
Hey thanks for the apology. I appreciate it.
It was akin to relying on a videogame glitch to do something that shouldn’t have been possible and then be offended that it got patched.
Let me introduce you to any% speedrunners
“Put it back! I liked it better when it was broken!”
Jokes aside though, have you SEEN GamesDoneQuick’s Triforce% TAS? Jesus Turing Christ, that was amazing. It felt like the gaming equivalent of watching the Lunar Landing.
Speedruning is always witchcraft but ACE is on such a different level it’s insane.
@ryujin470@fedia.io here’s a brief list, in no particular order and based pretty much entirely on my own opinions and experience.
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you have to learn a little bit about what happens behind the scenes sometimes. for example, if you don’t know what distro packages are or what flatpak is (or the reasons behind each of them, honestly) then installing apps kinda sucks at first.
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you can end up installing a package thinking it is the official one, when in fact it is some variety of third-party. generally this doesn’t really hurt anything but it can (look up fedora flatpak).
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sometimes cool features get stuck in limbo because none of the people who want them know how to code
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sometimes cool features get stuck in limbo because of politics (in-project politics, not what you probably thought at first)
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it can be hard to figure out if something is good or if the people reccomending it are just trying to help a new user find something easy and, since they don’t actually use it and haven’t for a while, don’t know that it kind of sucks now (I’m thinking of ubuntu here but it happens with a lot of stuff, distro or otherwise)
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all the damn tribalism
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drivers are hell on most distros
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app availabilty on non-.deb systems
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some apps refuse to look native (gtk apps on kde, qt apps on gnome, anything made by a mac user for some reason, every browser fighting tooth and nail to default to windows titlebar icons)
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all the damn tribalism
- Is a duplicate of 6.
Your comment is to be
closeddeleted in 3…2…1…yeah but 10 is so obviously better than 6
no idea what you’re talking about
OP’s riffing a joke off Stack Overflow’s tendency to kill duplicate posts.
@shalafi@lemmy.world I was joking too
@ryujin470@fedia.io @BuboScandiacus@mander.xyz
You should have capitalized one of the two so they would be case-sensitively different but parse the same, another thing to get used to on linux.
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Software compatibility for things such as Adobe products and other things that are built specifically for windows.
And a lot of hardware
the vast majority of my work software is windows/mac (although the expensive software I wish I could afford just added linux support in 2022). that’s the big one for me. on a smaller note i haven’t checked on my games since, i mean if i’m going to have to run a windows box i might as well take advantage of the plusses, but i understand there is significantly worse compatibility on linux.
I’ve been using Linux Mint for the last 1–2 months (or so) and one of the things I miss the most is how on Windows, games just run (typically). Now, on Linux, one of the very first things I do upon wanting to play a new game is check the ProtonDb page. I am not always able to play the game I want. There’s often not even any ProtonDb page for a lot of older games, notably in my case Jazz Jackrabbit. (For example, even though the Jazz Jackrabbit Collection on GOG has a Linux installer, for some reason it won’t run.)
Make no mistake, I ain’t never going back to Windows for my personal use if I have anything to say about it. The sense of personal security I feel from not having my every move be captured, scrutinized, and sold by Microsoft is way too important to me. If I can have that feeling of relative comfort by forgoing a few games, it seems like a worthwhile price to me.
Nevertheless, the “plug-and-play” nature of games designed for Windows is something I miss.
@EveryMuffinIsNowEncrypted@lemmy.blahaj.zone idk about GOG but in my experience any games through steam just work unless they have some shitty anticheat
@ryujin470@fedia.io
Yeah, I don’t really buy most of my games through Steam. Mainly just GOG since I like to own my games. Still, I will buy from time to time games on Steam, like with the Portal/Half-Life sale like half a year ago or whatever, to support Valve, which is a good company and I respect them a lot.
GoG install scripts are actually community-submitted and not actively maintained. You might have some luck with Lutris or WINE. Sometimes, Bottles or even PlayOnLinux are compatible. WINE actually lets you emulate older editions of Windows for PC games. Sometimes, all you have to do is switch the toggle from ‘Win7’ to ‘Win95’, and it works.
https://lutris.net/games/jazz-jackrabbit/
It’s a headache, and a loooot of googling, trying to get games to run. But with Proton’s introduction, it’s gotten a lot easier to get things to run without pulling out wads of hair.
But you’re right, if the app is non-native? Have fun breaking out the thumbscrews, because ya better like pain. 😂
Not a bad set of promising suggestions… Thanks!
And yeah, I’ve found Proton to be invaluable for making things soooo much easier, but if a game doesn’t have a page, it’s not as easy. Lol.
It always feels like it’s someone’s hobby and not a mature product.
Fixing nearly anything is digging through a text file that might follow a standard but never the same standard as the last text file.
Doesn’t have the apps people need/want
For me, it was the lack of support for certain Wi-Fi cards. I had to pull an older Wi-Fi card out of an old Chromebook, because no flavor of Linux supported the card that came with the (Windows 11) laptop. And guess who has two thumbs and no Ethernet port…
Finally got it working, but at one point i was almost willing to have a USB tether to my phone, just so i wouldn’t have to fight with windows anymore.
Edit: Just realized it said desktop, but my desktop also has Wi-Fi, i just haven’t had the courage to switch fully from my Spectre Win 10 install…
- Wifi
- Adobe suite
- Drivers
AMD has open-source drivers that play better with Linux distros. If you’re running post-2020 Intel hardware, good luck.
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Just installed Debian, no wifi
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Lots more stuff just like #1, such as my 10 year old and 3 month old Logitech wireless mice weren’t detected, and support for them is (fortunately) only available from a third party, which I found by searching the web for an answer.
I could give you pages of why Linux doesn’t compare to Windows for the desktop, which I’d follow with where it really shines - as a server for all kinds of things. It’s so good for specific tasks that even VMware replaced their own Workstation virtualization with Linux KVM.
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I’m using Linux Mint for my daily driver for about 5 years. It works great with no ads!! I’m not a gamer and Libre Office works well for me so no significant problems with software. I also do some basic python programming on it. The more complex command line stuff takes a while to figure out but Mint has been great!
I’ve never seen an ad on Windows. Not sure what people do to get ads.
Open the Start menu, usually
Good thing Everything bypasses the need for this.
Play Solitaire
For me if an application isn’t on the pop-shop then its very hard to install, I’ve had people tell me to just not download things from the internet, but when the application I need isn’t on the pop-shop or the repos its a non-starter.
Downloading the .deb from the website is very hard? Not being sarcastic, hoping to understand
If its a flarpack it just works, but most other formats I’ve had enough trouble with to not bother with them anymore. Incl .debs.
Debs should work just fine on a Debian based os like pop.
Debs should work just fine on a Debian based os like pop.
hahahahahahaha
Downloading the .deb from the website is very hard? Not being sarcastic, hoping to understand
It has to be specific to your distro, and your version of the distro, and compatible with any modules you’ve added. Ain’t gunna happen.
This is why containers like flatpacks and snaps were developed.
Pop-os is Ubuntu based as far as I’m aware
Ubuntu is based on Debian, so Pop_OS! still uses .deb