Face it, Linux is just the kernel. You use systemd as your operating system.
wow, I could read and entire book of this. It’s a new genre of erotica I think. Very high quality
Do you want the pegging scenes to be implied or graphic?
Yes.
Can it be implied that they’re very graphic?
No, a real linux user only needs a cli
So, not graphic, just verbose.
pegging -v
Not verbose enough, needs the -vvv
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Parts of 4chan’s take on the Big Bang Theory may fit the bill:
I am so scared and aroused
scaroused
Without the mention of mansplain and womansplain this would be funny
I work in IT and sometimes I have to explain something to a user who is somewhat tech-illiterate. Even developers may have significant blind spots when it comes to their OS or networking, for example.
So, if I notice it, I’ll change some terminology and I may explain instructions differently or use metaphors so every user understands what I’m saying.
And most coworkers do the same thing.
Here’s why I bring this up: For whatever reason, some colleagues give female coworkers the same treatment.
And that’s weird.
If someone is constantly treated like this, they should be allowed to rant about it on their blog. I’m fine with snark if it geht’s a point across.
Is it bad if I tend to do this except to everyone because I don’t generally expect people to know the same specific stuff as me?
No. If it’s everyone, then it’s everyone and at worst it’s not the most efficient way to communicate.
I would say, if you single out a group of people based on physical characteristics, then it gets weird.
But if it’s “The internet won’t start” vs “Every packet on port 433 is dropped even though no firewall rule is set”, then I think it’s reasonable to make some asumptions and adjust communication accordingly.
Oh yeah definitely. With that second one, is be requesting explanation for myself!
It’s really just that when I start to say anything about anything I’m interested in, I get a “why do you think I know anything about that?” a lot, so I shifted gears to the opposite early in life. I go explaining all the things involved with what I’m talking about before I get to the point and people think I’m tangential.
I love the examples!
hey look its the guy from the meme
That’s fine. It’s proof that both exist and one is deadly.
Ya’ll need God.
Posting this from TempleOS
How’d you get internet working?
All things are possible through Christ lol
All things are possible though profound autism and schizophrenia
Holy Water most likely
A typical ActivityPub+Lemmy post.
And its just beautiful.
It would seem that GNU/Linux or Linux (whatever the user-accessing operating system is called) is the only OS that must mention its kernel. No one calls Windows the NT operating system, nor does anyone call Mac OS the Darwin operating system. So why should Linux be the exception?
When I think of GNU, I think of a project that had a very particular goal in mind: build an operating system that replaces Unix with entirely free software. The project got nearly all the way there, but before they got a usable kernel working, Torvalds licensed his kernel with the GPL. With the Linux kernel combined with GNU, we have an OS the GNU project set out to create. So why should Torvalds get all the credit? Without calling the OS GNU, most people don’t even know how or why it came to be.
I could see a valid argument to just simply call the OS GNU. It was the name the original team gave the project to have a fully functional OS made with entirely free software. True, Torvalds didn’t write Linux for GNU, but neither did the X Window System. A Kernel is essential for operation though, so I can see why the name GNU/Linux was proposed.
Maybe it just boils down to “Linux” simply sounding better when pronounced
Just like e.g. most people just say “velcro” and not “hook-and-loop” as the company Velcro itself wants people to call it.
And that’s a tragedy because that convenience of pronunciation comes with the cost of losing credit for the group that started the whole thing. Because only “Linux” is used, many people think Linus Torvalds developed/invented the entire operating system.
Hook and loop being called Velcro doesn’t hurt Velcro the same way because they still have all the credit for making it. The only problem they face is losing a trademark.
Perhaps it is a tragedy that we seem to have lost the GNU part. But in the end, the great unwashed masses get to decide what something is called.
Personally, I blame the Brits for this, (and NOT the French this time), because of their penchant for trying to chop every multi-syllable word down into as few as possible. See: Football vs Soccer silliness.
“The OS” doesn’t exist. The operating systems you’re talking about are called Debian, Ubuntu, Arch, Fedora, RHEL, etc etc. The main work of making an actually usable OS from the various free software components others have written has always been done by the teams responsible for these products.
But we still need a way to refer to them collectively, and it used to make sense to call them “Linux” because they were pretty much the only operating systems that used the Linux kernel, but now that Android is the most widely used OS on the planet, it doesn’t anymore, and this alone is a reason to say GNU/Linux unless you want to include Android.
Systemd/GNU/Linux/GTK or Systemd/GNU/Linux/QT, really…
GTK being a part of GNU (at least originally)
Sure, I should have gone further.
Systemd/GNU libc/GNU Coreutils/GNU BASH/Linux/X11//GTK/GNOME
Systemd/GNU libc/GNU Coreutils/GNU BASH/Linux/X11/GTK/LXDE
Systemd/GNU libc/GNU Coreutils/Zsh/Linux/X11/GTK/GNOME
Systemd/GNU libc/GNU Coreutils/Zsh/Linux/X11/GTK/LXDE
SysVInit/musl/Busybox/tcsh/Linux/csh
Systemd/GNU libc/GNU Coreutils/Zsh/Linux/Wayland/QT/KDE Plasma
Systemd/GNU libc/GNU Coreutils/Zsh/Linux/Wayland/QT/LXQTetc, etc.
There are thousands of combinations of the possible layers needed to make an OS.
the thing is that not all of them use systemd or bash or zsh or even X11 (servers don’t usually have X11 installed)
All of them use a Linux kernel and many components that were originally developed for GNU, especially the C library.
Except Alpine & those based on it, which uses Linux but not GNU libc or GNU coreutils or GNU BASH… Just musl libc & Busybox. I.e. the entire subject of this thread is one of the non-GNU Linuxes.
Yes, I listed sysvinit for that reason. And Musl instead of glibc. GNU is optional in a Linux distro, except for the kernel’s use of a GNU license.
I understand distributions (Debian, Arch, etc.) are what users will use. But those distributions have a foundation to build off of (that’s what I’m referring to when I say OS), and that foundation most distributions use is GNU and Linux.
GNU came first, and the final piece of the missing puzzle was Linux. Adding in Linux shouldn’t overshadow all the incredible work the GNU project took over 7 years to create.
Android is a different issue, although it certainly puts a hole in the logic of calling the desktop OS Linux. “[Android] contains Linux, but it isn’t Linux.”
This is a rabbit hole. Most software packages out there use hundreds of modules with other names. Heck, I bet the client you are using would require 27 different slashes for this to make sense.
Sometimes you put a lot of work into a foundation. Sometimes you use a foundation. Pride in one’s work does not always require recognition.
I don’t use those, I select my own components using SystemD OS.
Like my configuration actually has to specify whether I’m using gnome or KDE, nothing is “by default” in my distro except for SystemD
But the Linux kernel was central to the advent of FOSS operating systems. If it were up to the GNU project we’d still not have a working OS. It’s unfair to speculate because maybe the BSD family would have taken over but it’s worth mentioning that Stallman also passed up on the BSD kernel as well. So, really, the GNU userland had to be dragged into widespread success against its goals.
Also, it’s a lot easier to replicate a basic userland than it is to get a working OS going. I think Linux would have done well even without the GNU utils but the opposite is demonstrably not true.
Because the thing people refer to when they say “linux” is not actually an operating system. It is a family of operating systems built by different groups that are built mostly the same way from mostly the same components (which, themselves are built by separate groups).
If I’m not mistaken, you’re talking about distributions. When I write ‘operating system’, I’m referring to a collection of programs that provide a set of utility for a user, such as file manipulation, the ability to compile other programs, etc. Distributions expand on that functionality by configuring everything, providing other programs, and methods to install more. But they mostly build off a common framework, the operating system. Linux is a component of that system that provides the framework. Should it get all the credit for doing so? Personally, I don’t think so.
What’s the deal with Alpine not using GNU? Is it a technical or ideological thing? Or is it another “because we can” type distro?
All the core tools are actually a single executable with many symlinks to it, which makes the distro very compact. This makes it very nice as a base for Docker images.
It’s because we can to an extreme. Extremely lightweight distro. Very nice in containers and vms. One of the most loved ones out there.
Yar
I don’t know if people use it on desktop but with its minimal size it’s convenient as hell for docker images that don’t need a lot of dependencies installed
I used it on a laptop for a while. Pretty impressive just how lightweight it is, but a bit of a grind to initially get everything working as expected. Overall, I’m a big fan.
I know it’s very efficient and small (I believe it needs less than 80mib of ram with nothing else running) and that they leave out some of the basic commands like man to save space. Maybe they wrote more minimal versions of some coreutils?
RAM usage depends on what you run inside the container not on the image size. If the container runs a single small program it will use a small amount of RAM regardless of the image it’s based on.
I specified that it would be running nothing (other than the init system which is the tty). Thereby the amount of ram required should not vary by much.
Actually, it’s GNU/unkempt, bearded man
💅🏻
I usually see it referred to as GNU/Linux. I always consider Android as Android/Linux to differentiate it from desktop.
Good take. GNU project + Linux = GNU/Linux. Android project + Linux = Android/Linux.
And if you’re talking about all of those in general, it’s just Linux.
I’ve come to the conclusion that lumping in Android/ChromeOS to the broad term is a stat padding exercise. It makes the whole of Linux look like it’s the most used OS in the world. But I’m OK with if you want to do so.
Call it GNU/Linux or Linux I don’t care. I just refer to it as whatever distro I’ve hopped to for this month. So to me, right now I’m typing this on my laptop running Fedora 40 KDE and my mini-desktop is running Fedora 40 Atomic Budgie.
I’m just running Linux. Or for the Linux people it’s KDE Plasma. Or Ubuntu with LXDE. Or degoogled Android. Or whatever, these are examples.
Don’t you dare to talk about Google Spyware OS in “general” with free OSes
Don’t you confuse people with your open os’es by calling them free. No charge is the only real free.
Ok, but what if there isn’t any GNU? Musl/Linux?
Then you call it Musl/Linux.
Musl isn’t entire userland
So I guess musl/busybox/Linux?
Is it OpenWRT?
Can someone explain to me why people get upset about it being referred to as gnu+Linux or gnu/Linux? I’m not the most techy person, so maybe I’m missing something obvious, but like, objectively, isn’t it just as much gnu code as Linux?
Again, not super techy, so please explain it to me like I’m the average Facebook aunt.
get upset about it being referred to as gnu+Linux or gnu/Linux
I would say it’s the opposite. Certain people get angry if you do not refer to it as GNU/Linux. These people used to be technically correct.
GNU tried to rewrite Unix from scratch under the GNU GPL license. They view their copy left license (a license where if you incorporate any code under their license, you must release the code of your project as well) as morally superior. Their kernel didn’t work out, but Linus Torvolds wrote another kernel for that GNU OS.
Obviously, GNU wanted credit for the OS components that were not Linux. That’s where the copypasta about “What you are using is in fact GNU+Linux…” came from. GNU is the heart of the free software movement so they have their fans as well that of course would also make that claim.
Of course, as the meme in the OP suggests, you can now have a Linux distro that either does not use code owned by GNU or uses very little of their code. I would argue Ubuntu, Arch, etc still are technically GNU+Linux as they use GNU’s C compiler, their C implementation, their userspace programs like Bash and grep, etc. However, Alpine uses alternatives to GNU software such as the musl C implementation.
Certain people get angry if you do not refer to it as GNU/Linux.
I’ve never seen this happen. I’ve heard a lot of people complaining about these people, though.
It’s like veganism. I’ve never met a militant vegan, but I’ve heard tons of people complain about them.
I think it’s an effective strategy to avoid taking about real issues.
I agree, outside of very, very few people it’s just a stereotype.
as far as i’m aware it’s just a copypasta, knowyourmeme explains it pretty well
It isn’t just a copypasta. As KnowYourMeme points out, it comes from Richard Stallman. Wikipedia has a good article about it here.
The term GNU/Linux is promoted by the Free Software Foundation (FSF) and its founder Richard Stallman. Their reasoning is that the GNU project was the main contributor for not only many of the operating system components used in the subsequent development of modern “Linux” systems, but also the associated free software philosophy.
It’s not a meme, people genuinely get upset about this. There was a post on a lemmy about the Comptia A+ study guide that had the question “What is GNU” with the answer of “It has to do with Linux” and people were writing essays on why this was not correct.
Pendatry. Very widespread in tech.
“Tech” is pretty broad. Sure, in software develo—-
nah only /s :)
error: expected ‘;’ before ‘}’ token
The definition of “operating systems” is not really clear. Some say the operating system is what is called the “kernel”. In the case of Linux operating systems, that kernel is called “Linux”. Most people, however, say that the operating system is the whole thing you install. That is, the kernel + a bunch of other apps.
For example, in windows: notepad, internet explorer (now edge), paint, and all those apps are part of the operating system, that’s what people mean when they say “windows”. It’s the whole package. Other less obvious parts are drivers for example.
In the case of Linux, most distributions ship with a bunch of GNU programs.
“Akschually people” argue that the GNU parts are as important (if not more) as Linux itself for the operating system, so they feel like all the hard work of the GNU developers is shadowed by the people that say “Linux”.
I mostly understand all that so far. My main question is why people get upset at folks who refer to it as gnu/Linux? I’ve seen a couple arguments about it on reddit, but I’m not sure how common it is for people to be actually upset, or if it’s more meme arguing. And I also I have no idea if I should say I use Linux or gnu/Linux since I use Fedora. Lol.
I’m one that finds the GNU/Linux naming annoying. I think calling it that is mostly silly, and am mostly annoyed at people who militantly argue it’s the only way to describe a Linux OS (which aren’t as common as they used to be).
To me, it’s just overly verbose and pointless. For the most part, the GNU part has been implied for pretty much any mainstream form of Linux for decades. And even if it wasn’t, who cares? Like, you wouldn’t say that you run KDE/X11/wpasupplicant/neovim/docker/pacman/paru/systemd/GNU/Linux… Just saying KDE on Arch Linux is simpler and far more informative.
It helps differentiate between GNU/Linux users and the five people who use GNU/Hurd
I don’t know about upset.
You refer to it as gnu/Linux, I won’t be upset. I’ll just slightly roll my eyes at your choosing to utter such an inconvenient word to make a point that doesn’t really need to be made. But ultimately it’s your breath that is being wasted not mine, so I don’t really care.
You start arguing about it, then it gets annoying because give it a rest. I am perfectly aware that gnu is a core part of the whole thing, I just don’t think it matters that I verbally pay tribute to it every single time I mention Linux. One word is enough to let you know wtf I’m talking about 99.999999% of the time, so I’m not adding another one that’s already implied basically always. Still not upset though.
Not the person you originally asked, but the main reason is probably that referring to it as gnu/Linux is 1) already deeply associated with the Richard Stallman meme, to the point that referring to it in that way automatically comes across as either a joke or just a person being intentionally contrarian, and 2) just really weird sounding. In the minds of most people, there is no real reason to refer to it as GNU/Linux, because the actual operating system that does the things the operating system is expected to do - as in provide an API for syscalls, memory management, etc - is just “Linux.” That it’s routinely built alongside a set of core utilities designed and maintained by GNU is largely pointless. It’d be like referring to a hamburger as Buns/Hamburger or Buns+Hamburger. It’s just…weird.
It’s the same reason why people argue about how to pronounce GIF. People get used to doing things one way and they don’t want to change.
When I learned that the creator of GIF pronounces it as JIF my world was turned upside down.
My guess: it’s a mouthful and not catchy. “Linux” is short, catchy and easy to pronounce. With “GNU/Linux” I don’t even know if I’m supposed to spell out the GNU or pronounce it as a word, and I don’t know if I’m supposed to say the “/” as “slash” or “plus” or “and” or if it should actually just be silent. I like to type how I speak, so if I don’t know how to say it I’m not going to write it, and I’m not going to like reading it.
I can totally see the merits for “GNU/Linux” but don’t underestimate the importance of catchiness. Maybe if it were shortened to “Ginux” it could stand a better chance, but then we’d have another gif situation.
Lignux
Which when you try to say it as written sounds like some degenerate version of “lick nuts” which is possibly not intended?
Lignux balls)) Btw, I personally like it, shame it won’t spread.
Everyone has to hate something to feel better about themselves. I’ve tried alpine and no thanks. Its great if someone likes it but I’ll just stick with what has been working for nearly 20 years.
I admit I don’t know much about it, but I got the impression that it’s great when you need a very minimal Linux system, like for Docker containers.
Ride his face into VALHALLA!!!
i use gnu/windows btw
Cygwin on Win7 back in the day was pretty close tbh.
You’ve triggered my working with GameCube/Wii through Cygwin PTSD.
Laughs in LLVM-compiled kernel.
Why are yall so mad about GNU and Free Software movement that it has started? Do you prefer to go to the old times? Apple microsoft fanboys?
Doing an entire OS and library to not use GNU it’s like Apple doing the LLVM to not having to use the GCC. Instead you could be helping in the free software movement and development, but you prefer to go into a GNU vs. Linux fight.
The war should be all the free software movement vs the companies fake open source shit.
This is a joke. Most people are not remotely concerned about these things.
For real why are people so hyped about having less software built by people principled in protecting their freedoms?
GNU and the FSF are awesome!
Found the Debian user.
You pure, unadulterated bastard.
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This post has nothing against GNU. It’s just a way to bash on annoying linux bros who want to correct everyone.
Word. Running eyes wide open into oblivion. GNU is a big part why our system is as superior as it is.
It’s just funny to annoy people who insist on using GNU/Linux
Because it’s being pedantic and it’s being wrong. And that’s annoying.
Software is not named by the compiler used or the tools included in the end package.
GNU project is not just compiler. Is isn’t just Emacs either.
IDK, but I think it’s cool that people have the option. Maybe if you’re just coming up with new ways to do the same things, if they turn out to be better GNU can take inspiration and other distros can switch, benefitting everyone. Or it could just be as a fun hobby, many people do these sorts of things just because it’s what they enjoy doing. I guess it might be the sort of thing you do just to see if it can be done.
