(transcribed from a series of tweets) - @iamragesparkle
I was at a shitty crustpunk bar once getting an after-work beer. One of those shitholes where the bartenders clearly hate you. So the bartender and I were ignoring one another when someone sits next to me and he immediately says, “no. get out.”
And the dude next to me says, “hey i’m not doing anything, i’m a paying customer.” and the bartender reaches under the counter for a bat or something and says, “out. now.” and the dude leaves, kind of yelling. And he was dressed in a punk uniform, I noticed
Anyway, I asked what that was about and the bartender was like, “you didn’t see his vest but it was all nazi shit. Iron crosses and stuff. You get to recognize them.”
And i was like, ohok and he continues.
"you have to nip it in the bud immediately. These guys come in and it’s always a nice, polite one. And you serve them because you don’t want to cause a scene. And then they become a regular and after awhile they bring a friend. And that dude is cool too.
And then THEY bring friends and the friends bring friends and they stop being cool and then you realize, oh shit, this is a Nazi bar now. And it’s too late because they’re entrenched and if you try to kick them out, they cause a PROBLEM. So you have to shut them down.
And i was like, ‘oh damn.’ and he said “yeah, you have to ignore their reasonable arguments because their end goal is to be terrible, awful people.”
And then he went back to ignoring me. But I haven’t forgotten that at all.
There’s a fundamental difference between allowing Nazis to gather in your bar and selling works by fascist authors. First and foremost is the reality that anti-fascist action requires knowledge of fascist rhetoric, it is not just Nazis that have read Mein Kampf. It’s also just an unfair comparison. Nazis aren’t going to be attracted to buying their rhetoric only from a drag queen and hanging out in an online book seller’s coffee shop…
And even if they were… Good? Experience
is the bane of fear and hate.
I personally don’t think it’s particularly worthwhile, but there’s also the aspect of harm reduction.
Would you rather RuPaul get the proceeds from the sale, or the Koch Brothers?
This is not a simple question with objective facts to lean on. It is a conflux of opinion and ideology.
It isn’t censorship to refuse to be a part of distribution, just as it isn’t censorship for a publisher not to print a book they don’t think will be profitable.
Burning the work, punishing the author, punishing anyone that prints it, banning it from print, that is censorship.
They are entitled to the ability to write and to publish, but they aren’t entitled to make others take part in it.
Paradox of tolerance stuff here.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it - Aristotle (slavery stan)
(transcribed from a series of tweets) - @iamragesparkle
I was at a shitty crustpunk bar once getting an after-work beer. One of those shitholes where the bartenders clearly hate you. So the bartender and I were ignoring one another when someone sits next to me and he immediately says, “no. get out.”
And the dude next to me says, “hey i’m not doing anything, i’m a paying customer.” and the bartender reaches under the counter for a bat or something and says, “out. now.” and the dude leaves, kind of yelling. And he was dressed in a punk uniform, I noticed
Anyway, I asked what that was about and the bartender was like, “you didn’t see his vest but it was all nazi shit. Iron crosses and stuff. You get to recognize them.”
And i was like, ohok and he continues.
"you have to nip it in the bud immediately. These guys come in and it’s always a nice, polite one. And you serve them because you don’t want to cause a scene. And then they become a regular and after awhile they bring a friend. And that dude is cool too.
And then THEY bring friends and the friends bring friends and they stop being cool and then you realize, oh shit, this is a Nazi bar now. And it’s too late because they’re entrenched and if you try to kick them out, they cause a PROBLEM. So you have to shut them down.
And i was like, ‘oh damn.’ and he said “yeah, you have to ignore their reasonable arguments because their end goal is to be terrible, awful people.”
And then he went back to ignoring me. But I haven’t forgotten that at all.
There’s a fundamental difference between allowing Nazis to gather in your bar and selling works by fascist authors. First and foremost is the reality that anti-fascist action requires knowledge of fascist rhetoric, it is not just Nazis that have read Mein Kampf. It’s also just an unfair comparison. Nazis aren’t going to be attracted to buying their rhetoric only from a drag queen and hanging out in an online book seller’s coffee shop…
And even if they were… Good? Experience is the bane of fear and hate.
I personally don’t think it’s particularly worthwhile, but there’s also the aspect of harm reduction.
Would you rather RuPaul get the proceeds from the sale, or the Koch Brothers?
This is not a simple question with objective facts to lean on. It is a conflux of opinion and ideology.
That wiki page looks like Donald’s arch nemesis.
I agree that we shouldn’t be tolerant of the intolerant, but I don’t think censorship is the right tool to use in that fight.
It isn’t censorship to refuse to be a part of distribution, just as it isn’t censorship for a publisher not to print a book they don’t think will be profitable.
Burning the work, punishing the author, punishing anyone that prints it, banning it from print, that is censorship.
They are entitled to the ability to write and to publish, but they aren’t entitled to make others take part in it.
If you oppose banning books in libraries you should also oppose banning the sale of books.
Libraries are public institutions, book stores are not.
Public institutions must play by the rules of the people, private companies are only bound by the rules of the law.
Law is the lowest common denominator of standards. You should hold them to higher ideals than that.
Personally, I do. But I doubt any company gives a shit what my standards are.
Should we put Nazi propaganda books for children into libraries?
Don’t we?
I mean, as long as there aren’t any mentions of the LGBT+ community in them.