Thank you for your thorough response.
You make some good points. I think weāre talking about slightly different topics though.
Thereās always some explanation to why certain words or grammar forms evolved. Sometimes those reasons are commonly known, sometimes the ācommonly knownā reasons are wrong, sometimes linguists argue about the origin, sometimes they have no idea.
For everyday speakers, the ālogicā of immediate usage, is more important than the etymology.
German speakers are generally aware of the āruleā that diminutives are neuter. If you look at this list words, some of them have non-diminutive forms;
Die Katze
Der Hund
Die Ohrlappe
Two of them donāt really.
āPlatzā is grammatically, the non-diminutive form of āPlƤtzchenā but it doesnāt mean ā(normal sized) cookieā (aside: Not to make fun of our Northern friends but āKeksā gets around that confusion)
āMagdā is the non-diminutive form of āMƤdelā but girls arenāt (generally) ālittle maids.ā I canāt remember the last time I heard anyone say, āmagdā to refer to a living person.
Also notice that when we strip off the diminutives, the remaining words are no more ālogicalā. Cats and earlobes arenāt inherently feminine and dogs arenāt inherently male.
My usage of ālogicā in the context of German grammar, is that grammatical gender is often at odds with both self identified gender and biological gender. German speakers are generally comfortable saying āDerā about subjects, that nobody would think of as male. German speakers are likewise comfortable saying āSieā about subjects that nobody would think of as female and, āDasā to subjects that are very obviously not neuter.
The reason for contrasting several languages was that I suspect there are different cognitive loads involved in correctly gendering people, depending on language.
Many people notice that native Chinese speakers routinely ārandomizeā he/she/it. They donāt just misgender trans-people, they often just forget which one means which.
German speakers are pretty used to playing around with endings to imply additional meaning. āDutzenā is often done without the word āduā. Speakers easily put together the correct endings for the singular and listeners instantly recognize the implication.
As a final example, Iād offer the sentence, ā___ ist ein fesch__ ___.ā I posit that if I insert āDieā vs āDerā into the sentence, most German speakers would instantly correctly fill in the rest of the blanks with, ā-es Madlā or ā-er Buaā. If you try to say the wrong one it just sounds weird.
Thank you for your thorough response. You make some good points. I think weāre talking about slightly different topics though.
Thereās always some explanation to why certain words or grammar forms evolved. Sometimes those reasons are commonly known, sometimes the ācommonly knownā reasons are wrong, sometimes linguists argue about the origin, sometimes they have no idea.
For everyday speakers, the ālogicā of immediate usage, is more important than the etymology.
German speakers are generally aware of the āruleā that diminutives are neuter. If you look at this list words, some of them have non-diminutive forms;
Die Katze
Der Hund
Die Ohrlappe
Two of them donāt really.
āPlatzā is grammatically, the non-diminutive form of āPlƤtzchenā but it doesnāt mean ā(normal sized) cookieā (aside: Not to make fun of our Northern friends but āKeksā gets around that confusion) āMagdā is the non-diminutive form of āMƤdelā but girls arenāt (generally) ālittle maids.ā I canāt remember the last time I heard anyone say, āmagdā to refer to a living person.
Also notice that when we strip off the diminutives, the remaining words are no more ālogicalā. Cats and earlobes arenāt inherently feminine and dogs arenāt inherently male.
My usage of ālogicā in the context of German grammar, is that grammatical gender is often at odds with both self identified gender and biological gender. German speakers are generally comfortable saying āDerā about subjects, that nobody would think of as male. German speakers are likewise comfortable saying āSieā about subjects that nobody would think of as female and, āDasā to subjects that are very obviously not neuter.
The reason for contrasting several languages was that I suspect there are different cognitive loads involved in correctly gendering people, depending on language. Many people notice that native Chinese speakers routinely ārandomizeā he/she/it. They donāt just misgender trans-people, they often just forget which one means which. German speakers are pretty used to playing around with endings to imply additional meaning. āDutzenā is often done without the word āduā. Speakers easily put together the correct endings for the singular and listeners instantly recognize the implication.
As a final example, Iād offer the sentence, ā___ ist ein fesch__ ___.ā I posit that if I insert āDieā vs āDerā into the sentence, most German speakers would instantly correctly fill in the rest of the blanks with, ā-es Madlā or ā-er Buaā. If you try to say the wrong one it just sounds weird.