They are quite warped. That part is true.

So, there can be no consequences for speech? That’s bullshit.

Are some overly zealous in their response? Sure. Is that authoritarian? Hell no.

Yes some of the arguments they make are completely absurd and tone deaf for keeping them. Like somehow the cultures that made them wouldn’t take care of them and it’s far too important for them to have have it and preserve it. Than the people they stole it from

It was a far right lemmy instance that everyone almost immediately de-Federated with. Due to misogyny, bigotry, trolling etc.

Full disclosure, it’s something I remember being said. Got no direct proof of it ATM. But there are a lot of rightoids and adjacent on that instance. I have it filtered iirc.

Well yeah. Doesn’t it have direct lineage to exploding heads etc? In my experience it’s quite far right/fash friendly.

Nothing. That’s my point. They have access to other news sources. They choose the ones that they like to hear.

Then share your citation. That’s a broad specious claim. There absolutely are some like that yes. But I have yet to see any studies showing anything remotely similar.

Nowadays, ~95% of the country has internet access - in actuality, not ‘could get it if they wanted’.

Again, citation for this?

Maybe “We just need to sit down and have a talk with literal Nazis” isn’t the winning strategy it sounds like.

Which is why, if you’ll note. I never suggested that.

Bruh, every accusation I’ve leveled thus far is absolutely things they are doing.

I never claimed otherwise. Just that those sorts are not as representative as they’re being portrayed.

I know for a fact that ridiculing those acknowledging the cognitive dissonance. Will 100% divide us and push them back into the arms of the propagandists.

No one is suggesting we do this to any conservative / Republican Congressman or elected official. Fuck each and every one of them completely. They 100% know what they’re doing. Or any conservative personality for broadcaster. They’re even worse generally. Or any gleeful little cult member. But only to those average people who acknowledge a Divergence in what they were told and reality. You miss 100% of the shots you don’t take. And while this leopards/faces thing is silly and cathartic. It absolutely will not reach any of the reasonable still reachable ones. Of which there are plenty. Just making enemies of them all the more sure

You’re still arguing past the point though. What does the internet do for most of these people that local radio and TV technically hasn’t or couldn’t?

Also possibility of access is drastically different from actually having access. Having access is also drastically different from actually using. I have friends and acquaintances that 100% unironically use their phone for phone calls only. Outside of using it as a camera some. I guarantee that their service plans all have data included.

Further, people can and often do still live without owning a computer or accessing the internet. I don’t know how. I can’t. They’ll continue to do so until all traditional broadcasting is ended. Yes the internet can replace all of that. But it hasn’t. Even then it’s a wickedly double edged sword which has led even more into even more extreme indoctrination. So it’s hardly a panacea.

Right now many of these people are struggling with the biggest case of cognitive dissonance they’ve ever had. It’s the perfect time to strike. And plant the concept that they’re being lied to, by all their local broadcasters. The evidence is there, they’re seeing it. We could talk to them about it like adults. Or we could accuse them of things they aren’t doing. Gloat and ridicule them for internet points. Causing them to retreat and double down, being just as bad as they are. Letting the oligarchs continue to divide us and win.

I mostly agree with you. I wood just like to add that this isn’t a modern thing or even a modern conservative thing. It’s a human nature thing throughout all of human history.

You are absolutely right though that social pressure plays a lot into it as well. Currently my girlfriend is in north carolina. She doesn’t have cable. She knows that all three of the major local broadcast stations are all Sinclair propaganda as well. And doesn’t get her news from them. However she isn’t particularly engaged digging up News online. Outside of what her anarcho communist boyfriend sends her way. I’m working on that. Believe me I am. However she absolutely gets it from everyone within for proximity. Even if she doesn’t watch herself. Human beings are very coated to generally believe what those around them believe. It’s the rare ones that will go against the opinion of their local society.

A lot of them don’t. In fact I’d have to guess for everyone that does there’s probably two or three that don’t. It’s an easy answer. Too easy to answer. But you’ll find out that if you talk to many of them it doesn’t tend to match up. Yes Facebook is still plenty of problem. And no one should use it. But there are other problems than Facebook And Fox News. As long as we focus on just those. the actual core of the problem goes unaddressed.

Right there. There’s your problem. For most of these people there’s only one TV package and that’s ABC, CbS, NBC, and whatever couple of quirky local UHF stations they still get. And when two if not three out of those three major network stations are owned by Sinclair. Then they get no alternatives. Plenty of places don’t get cable and tv packages. Plenty of places can only get satellite and it’s spotty at best. Even then if that is also an extreme luxury.

I’ve lived in a rural area and can confirm. Not all rural areas are in the thrall of propagandists like Sinclair. However far too many are. I know of at least three or four different markets that from personal experience don’t have any news other than Sinclair’s. And I know how much I have to struggle to keep family and friends there informed.

You and I generally agree on most things. And I have a high enough opinion of you that I think that you can recognize and acknowledge that your experience while valid. May not be universal. Also none of this absolves in from their role in any of this. But the best way for us to reach them is with understanding and not accusation here. We’ve got Decades of evidence that contemplation and ridicule is only going to make it worse.

Their reality is legitimately different from your own. And as long as you refuse to acknowledge that. You will just push them to cling to their lies as much as you are clinging to your own.

By virtue of simply being here both of us are not typical or average. A lot of typical average people still don’t use the internet and don’t even rely much on cable. When everything around them tells them that reality is one particular way. And in general it doesn’t often negatively impact them they’ll believe it. Now when the cognitive dissonance is really hitting is the best time to break them from it.

Their local media didn’t cover any of that. And that’s the problem. It’s not a case of stupidity or willful ignorance for a lot of them. They don’t get their news from cable or online. Just their local reliable broadcaster. Which over the last 20 years has been bought now and replaced with propaganda from companies like Sinclair.

Do you want to hate yourself both literally and philosophically? Seek out the news coverage from your closest Sinclair affiliate. There’s a good chance this is more attributable to the fall of the fourth estate than any sort of ignorance or stupidity. A lot of these people get their news from the local broadcast. And when Sinclair controls all of those they cannot help but be uninformed.

This is actually a chance for us to reach out to them pointing out the failure of the media they relied to be informed with. Or we could choose to not build allies and coalitions and just laugh at them. For things that we ourselves could easily fall victim to

It was due to the success of fascist propaganda and Reagan’s overwhelming win. It rattled Democrats badly. Causing them to change their tac a bit. That and labor abandoning Democrats thinking they would teach them a lesson as well. It was a culmination of really bad choices that people still make to this day. Because they haven’t learned.

You get the respect you give monk.

Woke is a shortening of awake or awoken. Basically meaning to be conscious or aware. Which makes it even more absurd. Basically to be anti-woke would be to wish to remain asleep and unaware.

Yep. Enshitification behavior doesn’t cease once you’re technically a paying customer. If they hadn’t made a habit of enshitification. Clawing features away to put behind a paywall I’d give them some support. But I prefer foss anyhow. And for myself, I’m not missing anything.

Reagan broke the unions. The group that literally funded labor and the Democrats for decades upon decades. Third way Democrats arose out of necessity from the fall of the unions. They didn’t abandon the unions anymore than the unions abandoned them. The unions became unable to fund them like they used to. And Democrats now be holding to corporate donors became unable to support humans like they used to.